Who was it who mentioned Fram oil filters and dropping oil pressure?
in [Toyota]
|
Prev: The Most Powerful Natural Penis Enlargement Technique >><<
Next: Replace oxygen sensor even if check engine light does not come on
From: clare on 23 Nov 2009 23:55 On Mon, 23 Nov 2009 22:28:46 -0600, "Daniel Who Wants to Know" <danielthechskid(a)merrychristmasi.com> wrote: >"N8N" <njnagel(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:70d8d69c-b25e-48f5-9faf-9ca8ed6c795a(a)p23g2000vbl.googlegroups.com... >On Nov 22, 9:39 pm, "Daniel Who Wants to Know" ><danielthechs...(a)merrychristmasi.com> wrote: >> Put a Wix 51515 on it and you won't have a problem again. >> >> Daniel >> Bought a 95 Grand Caravan SE 3.3l with 223,000 miles on it for $800 and >> immediatly changed to a 51515 and Mobil 1 5w30 non-EP. I have 10k miles of >> my own on the van now and the engine is still going strong. > >That number sounds familiar... same filter as a 225 leaning tower of >power maybe? > >nate > > >The 51515 is AKA a Motorcraft FL1A. It is the filter specified for most >Fords and is just a longer version of the 51085 that is speced for the >Chryslers. The even larger version is the 51773 but according to Wix it >only has a 30 micron rating whereas the 51515 and 51085 have a 19 micron >rating therefore it may be useful for cleaning up a sludged and/or neglected >engine. > Yes, the FL1A is the same application as the Fram PH8A - fit Ford, Mopar, Toyota, and many other apps.
From: Fatter Than Ever Moe on 24 Nov 2009 02:23 Hachiroku ハチロク wrote: > On Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:35:54 -0600, jim wrote: > >> >>> I just find it funny that on three older cars, replacing the existing >>> filter with a Fram resulted in lower oil pressures. >> It doesn't take much to amuse <SLAP!> > > Go away, you irritating man. Isn't there the underside of a rock just > about your size? > > > Someone volunteer to to put two accurate oil pressure gauges on something, say a 98 Toyota Camry 4 cylinder. One before the filter, one after. The pressure differential will indicated the amount of pressure drop when the filter is new, if the relief is working when cold, and the amount of resistance as the filter clogs up and if the filter media ruptures. Also need a couple of accurate flow meter to determine volume of oil in the different flow circuits and of course a temp gauge at the entrance to the oil filter, and a recording chart or maybe a software program and laptop to record all the numbers....... then come up with the specs on what a filter should do for how long and keep the cost under 4 dollars retail. PRESTO ! You have reinvented the wheel! Or you could do like I used to do with my old 73 Chev Nova SS 6 cylinder, carry a spare filter, the oil pressure sender on that one was after the filter, when the pressure dropped with a warm engine I changed the filter. Whatever, I use Fram, they meet factory specs and do the job for my kind of driving. If you are really worried about engine life, drive easy until the engine is warmed up, then keep driving easy and you should get all the designed life from the engine and probably quite a bit more. The national debt on Nov 20, 2009 was 12,010,561,742,215.21
From: jim on 24 Nov 2009 08:27 Fatter Than Ever Moe wrote: > > Hachiroku ハチロク wrote: > > On Mon, 23 Nov 2009 20:35:54 -0600, jim wrote: > > > >> > >>> I just find it funny that on three older cars, replacing the existing > >>> filter with a Fram resulted in lower oil pressures. > >> It doesn't take much to amuse <SLAP!> > > > > Go away, you irritating man. Isn't there the underside of a rock just > > about your size? > > > > > > > > Someone volunteer to to put two accurate oil pressure gauges on > something, say a 98 Toyota Camry 4 cylinder. One before the filter, one > after. The pressure differential will indicated the amount of pressure > drop when the filter is new, if the relief is working when cold, and the > amount of resistance as the filter clogs up and if the filter media > ruptures. Also need a couple of accurate flow meter to determine volume > of oil in the different flow circuits and of course a temp gauge at the > entrance to the oil filter, and a recording chart or maybe a software > program and laptop to record all the numbers....... then come up with > the specs on what a filter should do for how long and keep the cost > under 4 dollars retail. Right. but no one here is going to do a meaningful experiment. What they will rely on is the partial evidence available ( the gauge on the dash board ). If the engine is in good shape the fact that one filter offers slightly more resistance than another shouldn't make any noticeable difference on the dash oil pressure gauge. The pressure relief valve controls the pressure. It's only when the engine and/or oil pump is badly worn that you are going to see the effects of different filter media on the oil pressure gauge ( if the vehicle has a gauge ) -jim > PRESTO ! You have reinvented the wheel! > Or you could do like I used to do with my old 73 Chev Nova SS 6 > cylinder, carry a spare filter, the oil pressure sender on that one was > after the filter, when the pressure dropped with a warm engine I > changed the filter. > Whatever, I use Fram, they meet factory specs and do the job for my > kind of driving. If you are really worried about engine life, drive > easy until the engine is warmed up, then keep driving easy and you > should get all the designed life from the engine and probably quite a > bit more. > The national debt on Nov 20, 2009 was > 12,010,561,742,215.21
From: jim on 24 Nov 2009 09:02 Nate Nagel wrote: > > Nate Nagel wrote: > > jim wrote: > >> > >> Nate Nagel wrote: > >> > >>> Everyone who's ever owned a car with an "upside down" oil filter knows > >>> that Fram ADBVs suck. > >> > >> Yeah and everybody knows the moon is made of green cheese. BTW which way > >> is upside down for a filter/ > > > > Base up. Base down doesn't require an ADBV unless there's a siphon > > effect somehow. > > FRAG! I knew what I was thinking, but typed the exact opposite. > > Base UP (as in a SBC and most other old school V-8s with an integral > filter mount) is "normal." Base DOWN (e.g. slant-six, Porsche 944, old > Ferrari V-12, etc.) *requires* an ADBV, either as part of the filter or > part of the base. OK. I almost asked which side of the filter you called base. FYI unless you have a leak in the plumbing or oil pump, there should always be a syphon back to the pan even if the filter has the inlet facing up. If there is no check valve that keeps the oil from draining back to the pan it will syphon back. My personal experience is that I know for a fact that large fleets of b-100 dodge vans with slant sixes were using Fram filters back in the 70's (early 80's too IIRC) without any problem. So I tend to believe mechanics that I know were handling Fram filters every day versus believing someone whose stated position is they never ever handle a Fram filter. I recall there was an issue with the slant six oil filters. Sometime back in the 60's or early 70's they changed the size of the filter on some slant sixes to a shorty version (IIRC trucks had an extra heavy duty version). The problem was some people used the old long filters thinking that would give them better protection. What happened when the long filter was used in this application was the filter would have an air pocket trapped in the top of the filter. That air bubble would be compressed when the engine was running and the filter behaved more or less normally while the engine ran. But when the engine was turned off the compressed air bubble would expand and push the oil out into the engine. That meant when you re-started the engine it need to push that quart or so of oil back into the filter before the engine would get any oil pressure. An incorrect interpretation of what was happening under those circumstances may be how this superstitious belief about Fram filters and slant sixes got started. -jim
From: Hachiroku ハチロク on 24 Nov 2009 09:55
On Tue, 24 Nov 2009 07:27:50 -0600, jim wrote: >> Someone volunteer to to put two accurate oil pressure gauges on >> something, say a 98 Toyota Camry 4 cylinder. One before the filter, one >> after. The pressure differential will indicated the amount of pressure >> drop when the filter is new, if the relief is working when cold, and the >> amount of resistance as the filter clogs up and if the filter media >> ruptures. Also need a couple of accurate flow meter to determine volume >> of oil in the different flow circuits and of course a temp gauge at the >> entrance to the oil filter, and a recording chart or maybe a software >> program and laptop to record all the numbers....... then come up with >> the specs on what a filter should do for how long and keep the cost >> under 4 dollars retail. > > Right. but no one here is going to do a meaningful experiment. What they > will rely on is the partial evidence available ( the gauge on the dash > board ). > > If the engine is in good shape the fact that one filter offers slightly > more resistance than another shouldn't make any noticeable difference on > the dash oil pressure gauge. The pressure relief valve controls the > pressure. It's only when the engine and/or oil pump is badly worn that > you are going to see the effects of different filter media on the oil > pressure gauge ( if the vehicle has a gauge ) > > -jim Wow! A succinct answer! But, if you're using the guage on the dash, it doesn't matter how accurate it is. It's relative. If it's off by a few PSI, chances are it's going to be off across the spectrum. And, no, I paid $400 for the car 2 1/2 years ago, it's rusting and I don't know if I'm going to bother with it after this year. Maybe, I like it. But it's a beater, and I want to make sure it *gets* through this winter. I may fix it because it is kind of a fun car to drive, but it is what it is. If I can do it cheap, OK. If not, the shredder is about 2 miles down the street. When I do the oil change, probably sooner than the 3,000 miles I usually do, because winter is creeping up, I'm trying a different filter. If the oil p comes back up, good! If not...did I mention the shredder is about 2 miles away? |