NUMMI Story on "This American Life"
in [Toyota]
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From: Bob Cooper on 29 Mar 2010 06:24 In article <mJqdncSZnqMmhy3WnZ2dnUVZ_tgAAAAA(a)speakeasy.net>, me(a)privacy.net says... > > On 03/28/2010 07:20 PM, Bob Cooper wrote: > > In article<jOWdnfKCEJsuYTLWnZ2dnUVZ_gmdnZ2d(a)giganews.com>, > > n5hsr(a)sprynet.com says... > >> > >> "hls"<hls(a)nospam.nix> wrote in message > >> news:0uudncQpRJf3bzLWnZ2dnUVZ_rCdnZ2d(a)giganews.com... > >>> > >>> "C. E. White"<cewhite3remove(a)mindspring.com> wrote in message > >>> news:G96dnVfJfLXoWTLWnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d(a)earthlink.com... > >>>> http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/403/nummi > >>>> > >>>> I listened to this yesterday. Very pro-Toyota and anti-GM. Completely one > >>>> sided since the only GM people they interviewed were connected to NUMI. > >>>> Most seemed bitter. I think they greatly over simplified the story in > >>>> order to praise Toyota. It really made the UAW look bad. Typical NPR > >>>> stuff., but still it was interesting. > >>>> > >>> > >>> When I first read about NUMMI, it seemed that Toyota got into this > >>> thing as an accomodation to GM. When GM folded, there was no > >>> reason to continue, this most expensive manufacturing site in America. > >>> > >>> I could be wrong. If GM had no alternative, then neither did Toyota. > >> > >> I had hoped that GM would learn why Toyota was able to sell its Corolla from > >> NUMMI (I'm driving one) for $1000 or so more than the Geo Prism that came > >> down the same line and was worked on by the same workers. They didn't. > >> > >> Charles Grozny > > > > A relative has had a Prism for many years. Good car. > > I had hoped that consumers would learn not to pay $1000 more for the > > Corolla. They didn't. > > Resale is better for the Toyota if sold still young. > > But when you get north of 100k miles it starts turning into a net loser > > on that score. > > eh? how do you figure that? year for year, any year, what is the > resale value of the prism vs the corolla? You can run numbers on kbb.com. Believe the numbers or not. But many private buyers/sellers use kbb to set the starting bargaining price for a used car. Bottom line is once a car is +10 years old and +100k miles the kbb resale value difference for Corollas and Prizms begins to merge, going below the $1000 initial Corolla premium mentioned. So if you intend to drive your car beyond those years/miles The Corolla offers no advantage. Unless you just need the Corolla label for personal reasons. Buying a 5 year old Corolla instead of a Prizm was always a sucker play. And according to my relative she saved close to $2000 buying the Prizm over the Corolla when she bought it new. But I don't know the truth, what rebates, etc were offered. People often lie about cars, even relatives. I do know it's a '95 Geo Prizm and last time I drove it it had about 150k miles and ran and drove well. She takes it to a Toyota dealer for maintenance.
From: dr_jeff on 29 Mar 2010 07:33 primemover wrote: > On Mar 28, 1:04 pm, "C. E. White" <cewhite3rem...(a)mindspring.com> > wrote: >> http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/403/nummi >> >> I listened to this yesterday. Very pro-Toyota and anti-GM. Completely one >> sided since the only GM people they interviewed were connected to NUMI. Most >> seemed bitter. I think they greatly over simplified the story in order to >> praise Toyota. It really made the UAW look bad. Typical NPR stuff., but >> still it was interesting. > > Those of you who buy into this coverage being "pro-Toyota" and "anti- > GM" are delusional and have you head in the sand. Listen to it again > without you instinctual bias flaming and you will realize the story > stands on its own and is a fine and objective piece of journalism. It's a very good piece of journalism. I find it different in that the style of the show is different than other "This American Life" Episodes. I think its objectivity is limited. The story that it tells is the story of the people who worked for NUMMI, GM and Toyota (at NUMMI and other facilities in the US and Japan). To me, I don't think that the show was about being anti-GM or pro-Toyota, but rather, just to tell the stories of the people. Jeff > Your attitude undermines the US economy as we lose the new jobs battle > to China and the other economies for true green technology developing > now.
From: edspyhill01 on 29 Mar 2010 07:44 On Mar 28, 9:51 pm, dr_jeff <u...(a)msu.edu> wrote: > jim beam wrote: > > On 03/28/2010 02:04 PM, C. E. White wrote: > >>http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/403/nummi > <SNIP> > The alternative is to let poor people in China stay poor. > > JEff <SNIP> I'm ok with that. As the Americans are layed off at my company more H1B's from India take their place. I guess to Britain India is the good colony, America is the bad colony.
From: C. E. White on 29 Mar 2010 08:07 "jim beam" <me(a)privacy.net> wrote in message news:gNGdnWaoWr-LvC3WnZ2dnUVZ_ruvnZ2d(a)speakeasy.net... > gm's manufacturing facilities in germany are considerably more > expensive than any they operate here. more expensive labor [MUCH > more powerful unions], components, logistics, etc. yet gm are able > to make a profit on those operations. odd how they say they're > unable to do so here. Are you sure about that? I keep reading how much money Opel has been losing... http://www.business-standard.com/india/news/gm-opel%5Cs-threatened-lossjobs-strains-eu-principles/377554/ From http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100325/ANE/100329938 : "GM is seeking 1.8 billion euros ($2.4 billion) in loans or loan guarantees from countries with Opel/Vauxhall plants towards the cost of a 3.7 billion euro restructuring to return the money-losing unit to profit in 2012. "So far the UK has pledged 300 million euros. Spain and Poland are still considering GM's request. "GM is seeking about 1 billion euros from Germany where Opel and half of GM's European workforce are based. "The U.S. automaker said earlier this month it would provide 1.9 billion euros in equity and loans to Opel, tripling its funding and cutting its request for state aid in a bid to win over European governments. "Opel plans to cut 8,300 jobs in factories across Europe, shutter a factory in Antwerp, Belgium and reduce production capacity by 20 percent." Ed
From: C. E. White on 29 Mar 2010 08:28
"jim beam" <me(a)privacy.net> wrote in message news:Fo-dnVpSIp1PdjLWnZ2dnUVZ_q-dnZ2d(a)speakeasy.net... > On 03/28/2010 02:04 PM, C. E. White wrote: >> http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/403/nummi >> >> I listened to this yesterday. Very pro-Toyota and anti-GM. >> Completely >> one sided since the only GM people they interviewed were connected >> to >> NUMI. Most seemed bitter. I think they greatly over simplified the >> story >> in order to praise Toyota. It really made the UAW look bad. Typical >> NPR >> stuff., but still it was interesting. >> >> > > did they mention the fact that g.m. exports its jobs to, and imports > componentry from china? or did they simply point out that toyota > creates american jobs and buys their componentry from american > manufacturers? As I have pointed out to you several times, if your goal is to buy the products with the most domestic content, then GM is who you would buy from. Toyota also build vehicles and components in China, just like GM, only more so. You are an uber-hypocrite - protecting a foreign manufacturer while trashing GM by complaining that they are buying some components from China. If you want to be a free-trade advocate and say we should turn the US car industry over to the Japanese because they are better at it, then I can understand that point. What I can't understand is this idea that you think it is OK to turn the US car industry over to Toyota while blasting GM for doing exactly the same sorts of things that Toyota does. > i doubt they said that japan is an ally and that china is not. or > that american taxpayer support of companies that export their > business and jobs to a country that completely disrespects human > rights, democracy or intellectual property is nothing short of > fraud. You should read about how Toyota treats "guest workers" or how they exploit labor in places like Thailand. Toyota has a long history of oppressing workers outside of the "home" factories. Toyota loves to show you pictures of the shiny main assembly palnts in US and Japan. They never show you pictures of the sweat shops they operate through subsiduaries. GM just wants to get on the Toyota bandwagon. > nomina rutrum rutrum Name little shovel litte shovel...ha ha.....it makes no sense. Ed |