electronic throttle
in [Toyota]
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From: jim beam on 15 Mar 2010 00:21 On 03/13/2010 08:03 PM, clare(a)snyder.on.ca wrote: > I've recieved more "first hand " information on the sticky throttle > situation with Toyota from a mechanic I know well and trust who has > run across the problem since well before the recall, on several > vehicles, including the Nissan Altima and Toyotas. He told the local > Toyota dealer a year and a half ago that they would be seeing a > massive recall in the near future. > The problem HE has run into, and that he now checks for on ANY car > with drive-by-wire at EVERY service is roughness in the operation of > the throttle control motor. They are not well sealed against moisture, > and when water gets in there are parts that rust. He says you can feel > a roughness in the operation by having someone press the accellerator > pedal with the key turned on and not running and simply putting your > fingers on the throttle control motor. Anything other than a perfectly > smooth operation will be quite obvious. He has replaced numerous units > on vehicles owned and driven by people (mostly salesmen) who put a lot > of miles on their cars - 2 year old cars with over 100,000 on the > clock - off warrranty by mileage. > When he finds one that appears rough under warranty he marks it on the > workorder and tells the owner to take it to the dealer for replacement > and to be sure it is written up on a workorder to document the > diagnosis and complaint if it is not replaced. On the ones he has > replaced the problem occurs when the driver goes to pass someone and > opens the throttle more than the normal amount. On some cars when it > happens the engine goes to fuel cut to limit power -but apparently on > some it does not. > NOT an electronic problem so much as an electromechanical problem in > this case. > > I'm not saying this is the ONLY problem - but it IS happening - and > not just on Toyotas. > Altima and Infinity are two other makes/models he mentioned having the > problem. > > then we need the mechanical opener, with electrical closer. about the worst thing you'll get out of that is a harsh automatic transmission shift. -- nomina rutrum rutrum
From: Rodan on 15 Mar 2010 02:39 This electronic throttle thing is great. If you believe everything that could be invented has already been been invented, do this: Replace something already invented with something else already invented and call it a new invention. This has been successfully done in automobiles by throwing away the familiar throttle cable and replacing it with a whole new system of electromechanical parts; Hall-effect position sensors, electric wire cables, electrical connectors, power transistor amplifiers, servo motors, and an expanded computer program to control it all. The brilliant scientists who created this new invention promise: "significant improvement in mileage and pollution control and significantly better control for things like cruise control and automatic transmissions too" They have revealed no numbers about how significant the improvements will be, but they have pointed out that the new system will bring a big improvement in safety. The wire inside the old throttle cable might bind or snap, whereas the Hall-effect/position sensors/electric wire cables/electrical connectors/power transistor amplifiers/servo motors and expanded computer program use electronic parts reliable for millions of operations. There is no way the new system can fail. It's only a matter of time before these scientific savants come up with other applications, such as eliminating the ripcord in parachutes. Instead of tugging on a ripcord, a skydiver could just touch the button on a Hall-effect sensor on his chest, and an electrical cable draped over his shoulder would transmit a signal to the parachute's computer telling it to let the power amplifiers energize the servomotors to release the latch on the chute. Instead of a conventional ripcord that could bind or break, a reliable electronically controlled ripcord actuation system would finally take all of the fear out of parachute jumping. The possibilities are endless. Are you tired of pulling a cord to raise your venetian blinds? Do it with a servo control system just like the electronic throttle. How about your lawnmower starter cable? Your church bell rope? Your light fixture pull chain? Your tampon string? As our lives are impacted by their leadership, the wisdom of the throttle cable replacement scientists will be demonstrated again and again. Best regards to all, Rodan.
From: Bill Putney on 15 Mar 2010 06:22 Rodan wrote: > This electronic throttle thing is great. If you believe everything that > could be invented has already been been invented, do this: Replace > something already invented with something else already invented > and call it a new invention. > > This has been successfully done in automobiles by throwing away the > familiar throttle cable and replacing it with a whole new system of > electromechanical parts;... Is it not true that the drive-by-wire systems have a cable connecting the accelerator pedal to the first electronic part? If so, a chain is only as strong as its weakest link - literally in this case. If that's the case, they'd be foolish to say that one benefit of the hi-tech solution is the elimination of the cable. I can believe some of the claims of better control of engines systems for power and emissions and possibly enhanced safety if it's done right, but they should leave out the part about eliminating the mechanical linkage. -- Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')
From: David Skelton on 15 Mar 2010 08:42 Your tampon string? > > > Best regards to all, > > Rodan. > > There might be a market for that one ;-) David --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: news(a)netfront.net ---
From: Bob Cooper on 15 Mar 2010 09:08
In article <806g3mFtd8U1(a)mid.individual.net>, bptn(a)kinez.net says... > > Rodan wrote: > > This electronic throttle thing is great. If you believe everything that > > could be invented has already been been invented, do this: Replace > > something already invented with something else already invented > > and call it a new invention. > > > > This has been successfully done in automobiles by throwing away the > > familiar throttle cable and replacing it with a whole new system of > > electromechanical parts;... > > Is it not true that the drive-by-wire systems have a cable connecting > the accelerator pedal to the first electronic part? If so, a chain is > only as strong as its weakest link - literally in this case. If that's > the case, they'd be foolish to say that one benefit of the hi-tech > solution is the elimination of the cable. I can believe some of the > claims of better control of engines systems for power and emissions and > possibly enhanced safety if it's done right, but they should leave out > the part about eliminating the mechanical linkage. The real issue is giving sensors, computers, servos, etc, control over throttle opening, instead of a direct and simple mechanical link to the human foot. Cruise control, simple as it is, has had plenty of issues over the years. And that is asked to handle only one parameter. Fortunately, you have to turn it on, so most have no problem turning it off if it goes haywire. Besides, on most cars it is little used. Emissions and any other excuse for for removing direct throttle control from the driver's foot is nonsense. Because then you're saying the driver doesn't control the throttle. Simple as that. A throttle position sensor works fines. Drive by wire in a car is caused either by beancounting or letting the wrong engineers run the show. It is an abomination. Ask Toyota. That's all the proof you need. Case closed. Prediction: Toyota and others who have tossed out throttle cables will be putting them back. |