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From: geronimo on 7 Sep 2007 14:07
Its an 1988 Camry 4 cyl station wagon. Sometimes the starter works
fine, sometimes there is just a click. Been like this for the 2 years
I have had the car. There is an intmt. voltage drop of about 2 volts
in the wiring for the starter control terminal. Whenever it fails, I
just jump from the battery direct to the starter control terminal, and
it never fails to start then. Thought it might be a bad neutral
start safety switch, but I removed it without getting off the PARK
position and ohmed it out----- it is not resistive at all. So I
thought it must be a bad ignition switch. When it has failed I am
reading only 10 volts at the black wire with white stripe, which I
know feeds power to the starter control terminal. No wonder....a 2
volt drop to 10 volts would indeed give you a 'click'/no-start. But
I found that the terminal that is on the *input* side (toward the
battery) of the starter engage contact (of ignition switch) is also
dropping to 10 volts! This is a solid brown wire. So I have a problem
ahead of the iginition switch even. Maybe it is a bad relay or
connection to a relay in that black relay box on the drivers side
fender well? I can't tell where this wire goes to, as all the ign
switch wires just go into a bundle in the steering column.
THe simple fix is just to run a new wire from some point that is
hot whenever the key is turned to the ON position....but I'd rather
track it down and fix properly than do a band-aid fix. I can't find
my Camry manual at the moment, and even when I had it, the wiring
diagrams didn't correspond too well to what I actually have.
If any one can give me a heads' up where that brown wire (the one
feeding power through the ign switch to energize the starter) is
connected to, I'd appreciate it. That is where my bad connection is.

Thanks, geronimo
From: qslim on 7 Sep 2007 17:07
If you want to start a thread at toyotanation.com and pm me, i can sling
some diagrams your way.

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Message posted using http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.toyota.camry/
More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html

From: johngdole on 7 Sep 2007 21:35
Another source of diagram is Figure 15 on the Autozone's free guide:
http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/14/09/20/0900823d80140920/repairInfoPages.htm

Starter relay (the diagram doesn't show one for the 88 automatic) is
downstream of the ignition switch. Maybe the voltage drop caused
Toyota to add a relay to later Camrys, as shown in the diagrams.

It's probably in the wiring and/or dirty connections if you are seeing
a voltage drop at the input of the ignition switch. Because that
switch is HOT at all times. Which means it goes directly to the
battery.

If you have 7.5A IGN fuse, you might want to turn the key to ON (not
START), and see what kind of voltage you measure across the 7.5A IGN
fuse. It should also be 10V when you're having problems. If you have
the ALT fuse link or AM1/2 fuse links like in later models in the fuse
box these should yield battery voltage even when you have problems.
After this you know it's probably the wiring between the fuse link
block and the ignition switch.



On Sep 7, 11:07 am, geronimo <Jam...(a)grandecom.net> wrote:
> Its an 1988 Camry 4 cyl station wagon. Sometimes the starter works
> fine, sometimes there is just a click. Been like this for the 2 years
> I have had the car. There is an intmt. voltage drop of about 2 volts
> in the wiring for the starter control terminal. Whenever it fails, I
> just jump from the battery direct to the starter control terminal, and
> it never fails to start then. Thought it might be a bad neutral
> start safety switch, but I removed it without getting off the PARK
> position and ohmed it out----- it is not resistive at all. So I
> thought it must be a bad ignition switch. When it has failed I am
> reading only 10 volts at the black wire with white stripe, which I
> know feeds power to the starter control terminal. No wonder....a 2
> volt drop to 10 volts would indeed give you a 'click'/no-start. But
> I found that the terminal that is on the *input* side (toward the
> battery) of the starter engage contact (of ignition switch) is also
> dropping to 10 volts! This is a solid brown wire. So I have a problem
> ahead of the iginition switch even. Maybe it is a bad relay or
> connection to a relay in that black relay box on the drivers side
> fender well? I can't tell where this wire goes to, as all the ign
> switch wires just go into a bundle in the steering column.
> THe simple fix is just to run a new wire from some point that is
> hot whenever the key is turned to the ON position....but I'd rather
> track it down and fix properly than do a band-aid fix. I can't find
> my Camry manual at the moment, and even when I had it, the wiring
> diagrams didn't correspond too well to what I actually have.
> If any one can give me a heads' up where that brown wire (the one
> feeding power through the ign switch to energize the starter) is
> connected to, I'd appreciate it. That is where my bad connection is.
>
> Thanks, geronimo


From: johngdole on 7 Sep 2007 21:37
BTW, pull the fuse link blocks when measuring voltage, so any
electrical problem downstream doesn't pull the voltage down.

On Sep 7, 6:35 pm, johngd...(a)hotmail.com wrote:
> Another source of diagram is Figure 15 on the Autozone's free guide:http://www.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/14/09/20/0900823d801...
>
> Starter relay (the diagram doesn't show one for the 88 automatic) is
> downstream of the ignition switch. Maybe the voltage drop caused
> Toyota to add a relay to later Camrys, as shown in the diagrams.
>
> It's probably in the wiring and/or dirty connections if you are seeing
> a voltage drop at the input of the ignition switch. Because that
> switch is HOT at all times. Which means it goes directly to the
> battery.
>
> If you have 7.5A IGN fuse, you might want to turn the key to ON (not
> START), and see what kind of voltage you measure across the 7.5A IGN
> fuse. It should also be 10V when you're having problems. If you have
> the ALT fuse link or AM1/2 fuse links like in later models in the fuse
> box these should yield battery voltage even when you have problems.
> After this you know it's probably the wiring between the fuse link
> block and the ignition switch.
>
> On Sep 7, 11:07 am, geronimo <Jam...(a)grandecom.net> wrote:
>
> > Its an 1988 Camry 4 cyl station wagon. Sometimes the starter works
> > fine, sometimes there is just a click. Been like this for the 2 years
> > I have had the car. There is an intmt. voltage drop of about 2 volts
> > in the wiring for the starter control terminal. Whenever it fails, I
> > just jump from the battery direct to the starter control terminal, and
> > it never fails to start then. Thought it might be a bad neutral
> > start safety switch, but I removed it without getting off the PARK
> > position and ohmed it out----- it is not resistive at all. So I
> > thought it must be a bad ignition switch. When it has failed I am
> > reading only 10 volts at the black wire with white stripe, which I
> > know feeds power to the starter control terminal. No wonder....a 2
> > volt drop to 10 volts would indeed give you a 'click'/no-start. But
> > I found that the terminal that is on the *input* side (toward the
> > battery) of the starter engage contact (of ignition switch) is also
> > dropping to 10 volts! This is a solid brown wire. So I have a problem
> > ahead of the iginition switch even. Maybe it is a bad relay or
> > connection to a relay in that black relay box on the drivers side
> > fender well? I can't tell where this wire goes to, as all the ign
> > switch wires just go into a bundle in the steering column.
> > THe simple fix is just to run a new wire from some point that is
> > hot whenever the key is turned to the ON position....but I'd rather
> > track it down and fix properly than do a band-aid fix. I can't find
> > my Camry manual at the moment, and even when I had it, the wiring
> > diagrams didn't correspond too well to what I actually have.
> > If any one can give me a heads' up where that brown wire (the one
> > feeding power through the ign switch to energize the starter) is
> > connected to, I'd appreciate it. That is where my bad connection is.
>
> > Thanks, geronimo


From: johngdole on 7 Sep 2007 21:39
Also, when you measure 10V on the input of the ignition switch, the
switch is at OFF, right?



On Sep 7, 11:07 am, geronimo <Jam...(a)grandecom.net> wrote:
> Its an 1988 Camry 4 cyl station wagon. Sometimes the starter works
> fine, sometimes there is just a click. Been like this for the 2 years
> I have had the car. There is an intmt. voltage drop of about 2 volts
> in the wiring for the starter control terminal. Whenever it fails, I
> just jump from the battery direct to the starter control terminal, and
> it never fails to start then. Thought it might be a bad neutral
> start safety switch, but I removed it without getting off the PARK
> position and ohmed it out----- it is not resistive at all. So I
> thought it must be a bad ignition switch. When it has failed I am
> reading only 10 volts at the black wire with white stripe, which I
> know feeds power to the starter control terminal. No wonder....a 2
> volt drop to 10 volts would indeed give you a 'click'/no-start. But
> I found that the terminal that is on the *input* side (toward the
> battery) of the starter engage contact (of ignition switch) is also
> dropping to 10 volts! This is a solid brown wire. So I have a problem
> ahead of the iginition switch even. Maybe it is a bad relay or
> connection to a relay in that black relay box on the drivers side
> fender well? I can't tell where this wire goes to, as all the ign
> switch wires just go into a bundle in the steering column.
> THe simple fix is just to run a new wire from some point that is
> hot whenever the key is turned to the ON position....but I'd rather
> track it down and fix properly than do a band-aid fix. I can't find
> my Camry manual at the moment, and even when I had it, the wiring
> diagrams didn't correspond too well to what I actually have.
> If any one can give me a heads' up where that brown wire (the one
> feeding power through the ign switch to energize the starter) is
> connected to, I'd appreciate it. That is where my bad connection is.
>
> Thanks, geronimo


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