What percentage of 20 year old cars are on the road?
in [Toyota]
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From: clare on 28 Oct 2009 16:17 On Wed, 28 Oct 2009 11:51:57 -0700 (PDT), N8N <njnagel(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >On Oct 28, 2:09 pm, klu...(a)panix.com (Scott Dorsey) wrote: >> N8N <njna...(a)hotmail.com> wrote: >> >> >If it's a US-centric list, that makes sense, since neither was sold >> >here. >> >> It's a Canadian list. That's why it doesn't have Yugo on it. >> >> However, Peugeot, Renault, and Fiat all sold cars in the US for a while. >> You don't see a lot of them on the road today for reasons that will be >> immediately apparent if you ever drive one. >> --scott >> -- >> "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." > >Not in the last 20 years, I don't think. Last one to leave was >Renault I believe in something like '87 or '88? > >nate Peugeot/Chrysler stopped selling 505 in 1991 The renaul Alliance and Eagles ended in 1987
From: Mike Hunter on 28 Oct 2009 16:20 Perhaps your personal opinion explains why there are so many Crown Vic's and Grand Marquis in Florida and Arizona. There are a large percentage of older folks in those states, that are more highly educated with higher incomes, who maintain their vehicles better and will be less likely to drive in a way that will total the vehicle, than the purchaser of many of the small or midget cars that do not do nearly as well with longevity because they are more likely to keep them till they, or the car, dies. I think one reason one may keep their Toyota longer than average new car buyer, is the average Toyota buyers are older and more likely to be female. They buy cars like they buy their appliances. They rely on what they read in magazine like CR etc., rather than real car guys that read magazines like Motor Trend, Car and Driver, Road and Track etc. ;) "SMS" <scharf.steven(a)geemail.com> wrote in message news:4ae8670c$0$1625$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net... > dr_jeff wrote: >> The numbers are misleading, however. You can have a Lexus that has >> 200,000 mi going strong after 20 years, and a Ford Focus that has been >> worn out after 500,000 after 3 years. > > And the reverse could also be true. There are always outliers, but of all > the possible reasons for the results, the one you gave is probably the > least likely to affect the results. > > Remove the luxury makes, the niche brands, and the makes that were not in > existence for the full 20 years, and the brands that were the most likely > to be on the road for 11-20 years are: > > 1. Toyota > 2. Honda > 3. Mazda > 4. Buick > 5. VW > 6. Buick > 7. Chrysler (or is this a luxury brand?) > 8. Nissan > > The top two are very consistent with what you see on the road, at least in > the state I live in. Tons of older Hondas and Toyotas, VWs, and Nissans. > > What the survey doesn't take into account is the demographics of the > owners. Someone that purchases a Toyota or Honda is more likely to be more > highly educated and higher income, and will maintain their vehicles better > and will be less likely to drive in a way that will total the vehicle, > than the purchaser of many of the makes that did poorly in longevity.
From: Mike Hunter on 28 Oct 2009 16:25 How smart is a buyer that will pay 20% to 30% more to buy a Toyota, that they think is "better," when there are plenty of cars that are just as good, have bigger engines and get fuel mileage that is as good, or better than, a comparable Toyota? "80 Knight" <nospam(a)nospam.com> wrote in message news:kcadnQ7Gk-B8EXXXnZ2dnUVZ_jWdnZ2d(a)giganews.com... > "SMS" <scharf.steven(a)geemail.com> wrote in message > news:4ae8670c$0$1625$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net... >> Someone that purchases a Toyota or Honda is more likely to be more highly >> educated and higher income, and will maintain their vehicles better... > > What drugs were you on when you wrote that? >
From: Mike Hunter on 28 Oct 2009 16:29 I guess that could be true when one considers how few Saturns, Lexus' and MB's are sold annually in Canada. "C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)removemindspring.com> wrote in message news:4ae867c4$1(a)kcnews01... > > "SMS" <scharf.steven(a)geemail.com> wrote in message > news:4ae84eb5$0$1639$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net... >> C. E. White wrote: >>> A Toyota commercial they are running in my area claims that 80% of all >>> Toyota sold in the last 20 years are still on the road. This seemed to >>> be a very low number to me. What do other think? >> >> There was a study in Canada about this. >> >> For vehicles 11-20 years old, a 2006 Canadian study showed the following >> order for highest percentage of cars still on the road in Canada adjusted >> for how many were originally sold): >> >> 1. Lexus >> 2. Mercedes >> 3. Saturn >> 4. Infiniti >> 5. Acura >> 6. BMW >> 7. Volvo >> 8. Cadillac >> 9. Jaguar >> 10. Lincoln >> 11. Toyota >> 12. Honda >> 13. Mazda >> 14. Saab >> 15. Buick >> 16. Volkswagen >> 17. Chrysler >> 18. Nissan >> ---Industry Average--- >> 19. Oldsmobile >> 20. Subaru >> 21. Chevrolet >> 22. Ford >> 23. Pontiac >> 24. Audi >> 25. Mercury >> 26. Eagle >> 27. Dodge >> 28. Suzuki >> 29. Plymouth >> 30. Isuzu >> 31. Hyundai >> 32. Lada >> >> They warn that this data needs to interpreted correctly. Owners of older >> expensive luxury cars are more likely to repair their vehicle than junk >> it. Vehicles sold in large numbers into rental fleets rack up a lot of >> miles and have shorter life in years, but not necessarily in miles. Some >> vehicles in the list didn't exist 20 years prior to the study so there >> were no vehicles 16-20 years old, only vehicles 11-15 years old (this >> explains the anomaly of Saturn). >> >> Bottom line is that for vehicle brands in existence for the full 11-20 >> year time span, Toyota had the highest percentage of vehicles still on >> the road for non-luxury brands. > > This seems to discount the factor I am talking about - Toyota sales (both > in the US and Canada) have greatly increased over the last twenty years. > The average age for a set that includes all Toyotas sold for any period of > more than one year in the last twenty years will be lower than for a > company like GM that has had stagnent or a declining market share over > that period. Both have been selling cars for more than 20 years in the > market, but the average age of Toyotas sold during the twenty year period > is not as old as the average age for GM cars sold during the same period. > It seems to me that this must be an improtant factor. Unless you factor > this out, then all you are doing to confusing people...if you are Toyota, > it is a good confusion, if you are GM it is a bad thing. > >> What's also interesting is that vehicles like Volkswagen, which routinely >> ranks far below average in reliability, did relatively well. >> >> "http://www.canadiandriver.com/news/2006/060905-1.htm" > > .I look at cars like applainces. When they no longer meet my needs, I dump > them and get something else. In my opionion, VW owners (at least some VW > owners, and particularly old Bug owners) look at the cars as an end in > themselves. I think they take some sort of pride in proving that they can > keep a VW running despite the odds against them. When I was younger, I > felt like that about British Cars. I am smarter now... > > Ed >
From: Mike Hunter on 28 Oct 2009 16:34
Really? If that were true why does one see so many Fords and Chevy's at old cars shows but hardly ever see any Toyotas or Hondas. If they are so good where are the ones from the sixties and seventies? LOL "SMS" <scharf.steven(a)geemail.com> wrote in message news:4ae87849$0$1594$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net... > C. E. White wrote: > >> This seems to discount the factor I am talking about - Toyota sales (both >> in the US and Canada) have greatly increased over the last twenty years. > > These rankings are based on the number of vehicles originally sold, they > are not raw numbers. Not sure what you're trying to say here. > > The problem I see is that those rankings don't list the actual > percentages. They could be closely grouped together. No one argues that > Toyotas and Hondas have greater longevity and reliability than Fords or > Chevys, the debate is over how much greater longevity and how much greater > reliability. |