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From: FatterDumber& Happier Moe on 6 Dec 2009 13:33 dr_jeff wrote: > john wrote: >> Yeah, I think all the recent problems are likely computer related. >> These ECUs just aren't up to their tasks. > > Really. The ECUs definitely have problems, but please show us a better > way that doesn't involve electronics. Carbs worked well, but wasted > fuel. Without electronics, are air would be dirtier, we would use more > fuel. > > Please suggest a better way. > > Jeff > >> The problem, according to NHTSA, may be linked to onboard computers. >> "The agency indicates >> the problem could be linked to the onboard computer, or electronic >> control module. " >> >> >> http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20091205/AUTO01/912050334/1148/auto01/Feds-probe-stalling-reports-in-2-Toyota-models >> Carburetors worked well? How soon we forget. Hard starting in the winter, flooding in the summer, the cars had to run over rich when cold so they would stay running, sticking chokes, worn accelerator pumps, carburetor kits, adjusting idle speed and mixture, those were the good old days. Starters seldom made it to 60,000 miles, go back a little further, points, condensers, tune ups, spark plugs every 10K miles. Give me the computers and electronics any day, well except for this electric/electronic steering thing, I'm not so sure about that, but come to think of it, I wasn't so sure about electronic fuel injection when it came out.
From: dr_jeff on 6 Dec 2009 13:48 FatterDumber& Happier Moe wrote: > dr_jeff wrote: >> john wrote: >>> Yeah, I think all the recent problems are likely computer related. >>> These ECUs just aren't up to their tasks. >> >> Really. The ECUs definitely have problems, but please show us a better >> way that doesn't involve electronics. Carbs worked well, but wasted >> fuel. Without electronics, are air would be dirtier, we would use more >> fuel. >> >> Please suggest a better way. >> >> Jeff >> >>> The problem, according to NHTSA, may be linked to onboard computers. >>> "The agency indicates >>> the problem could be linked to the onboard computer, or electronic >>> control module. " >>> >>> >>> http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20091205/AUTO01/912050334/1148/auto01/Feds-probe-stalling-reports-in-2-Toyota-models >>> > > Carburetors worked well? How soon we forget. Hard starting in the > winter, flooding in the summer, the cars had to run over rich when cold > so they would stay running, sticking chokes, worn accelerator pumps, > carburetor kits, adjusting idle speed and mixture, those were the good > old days. Starters seldom made it to 60,000 miles, go back a little > further, points, condensers, tune ups, spark plugs every 10K miles. Give > me the computers and electronics any day, well except for this > electric/electronic steering thing, I'm not so sure about that, but come > to think of it, I wasn't so sure about electronic fuel injection when > it came out. You made my point exactly. Carbs did work well compared to the alternatives, though. They were also a pain in the back. And, they helped me go to college (my dad had an autoparts store). Let's not forget how the carbs help gas get into the oil, which sold more oil. And, helped destroy bearings, which was my bread and butter (literally). Jeff
From: Nate Nagel on 6 Dec 2009 13:51 FatterDumber& Happier Moe wrote: > dr_jeff wrote: >> john wrote: >>> Yeah, I think all the recent problems are likely computer related. >>> These ECUs just aren't up to their tasks. >> >> Really. The ECUs definitely have problems, but please show us a better >> way that doesn't involve electronics. Carbs worked well, but wasted >> fuel. Without electronics, are air would be dirtier, we would use more >> fuel. >> >> Please suggest a better way. >> >> Jeff >> >>> The problem, according to NHTSA, may be linked to onboard computers. >>> "The agency indicates >>> the problem could be linked to the onboard computer, or electronic >>> control module. " >>> >>> >>> http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20091205/AUTO01/912050334/1148/auto01/Feds-probe-stalling-reports-in-2-Toyota-models >>> > > Carburetors worked well? How soon we forget. Hard starting in the > winter, flooding in the summer, the cars had to run over rich when cold > so they would stay running, sticking chokes, worn accelerator pumps, > carburetor kits, adjusting idle speed and mixture, those were the good > old days. Starters seldom made it to 60,000 miles, go back a little > further, points, condensers, tune ups, spark plugs every 10K miles. Give > me the computers and electronics any day, well except for this > electric/electronic steering thing, I'm not so sure about that, but come > to think of it, I wasn't so sure about electronic fuel injection when > it came out. I have no problem with electronics, I wish they were just a little more robust. And I remember carbs too, but I don't remember having all that many problems with them. Only one that really sucked was the 2bbl Rochester on my dad's Chevy pickup; eventually replaced it with a Q-jet so it didn't have to be kitted every year. Like clockwork, about a year after you kitted it, the float would start sticking to the bottom of the bowl. nate -- replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply. http://members.cox.net/njnagel
From: someone on 7 Dec 2009 00:46 In article <4b1bf8f9$0$5354$bbae4d71(a)news.suddenlink.net>, FatterDumber& Happier Moe <"WheresMyCheck"@UncleSamLoves.Mee> wrote: >dr_jeff wrote: >> john wrote: >>> Yeah, I think all the recent problems are likely computer related. >>> These ECUs just aren't up to their tasks. >> >> Really. The ECUs definitely have problems, but please show us a better >> way that doesn't involve electronics. Carbs worked well, but wasted >> fuel. Without electronics, are air would be dirtier, we would use more >> fuel. >> >> Please suggest a better way. >> >> Jeff >> >>> The problem, according to NHTSA, may be linked to onboard computers. >>> "The agency indicates >>> the problem could be linked to the onboard computer, or electronic >>> control module. " >>> >>> >>> > http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20091205/AUTO01/912050334/1148/auto01/Feds- >probe-stalling-reports-in-2-Toyota-models >>> > > Carburetors worked well? How soon we forget. Hard starting in the >winter, flooding in the summer, the cars had to run over rich when cold >so they would stay running, sticking chokes, worn accelerator pumps, >carburetor kits, adjusting idle speed and mixture, those were the good >old days. Starters seldom made it to 60,000 miles, go back a little >further, points, condensers, tune ups, spark plugs every 10K miles. >Give me the computers and electronics any day, well except for this >electric/electronic steering thing, I'm not so sure about that, but come >to think of it, I wasn't so sure about electronic fuel injection when >it came out. uh, get a horse?
From: Don Stauffer on 7 Dec 2009 09:23
dr_jeff wrote: > john wrote: > > Really. The ECUs definitely have problems, but please show us a better > way that doesn't involve electronics. Carbs worked well, but wasted > fuel. Without electronics, are air would be dirtier, we would use more > fuel. > Why did carbs "waste" fuel? They used enrichment at high manifold pressure, but so do FI systems. The last generation of carburetors were quite good. What really is the difference between a carb and a throttle body electronic injection system? One is controlled by a pneumatic computer, the other by an electronic one. Admittedly electronic computers can be miniaturized, and add more computation. Essentially the carbs of the seventies and eighties DID have computers. The amount of measurement of their environment and the amount of control was remarkable. There were even the deceleration controls that got rid of richness during trailing throttle. They were marvels of fluidic computing. |