From: Mike Hunter on 5 Jul 2007 14:08
Those if favor of "tax" assistance do not think of the fact they are the
ones paying the tax money that is used to "assist," and that is going to a
foreign corporation that pays NO US federal corporate income taxes ;)
<dold(a)12.usenet.us.com> wrote in message news:f6gclb$dij$3(a)blue.rahul.net...
> In alt.autos.ford Bill Putney <bptn(a)kinez.net> wrote:
>> You can subtract the $787.50 from the savings because *somenone* (the
>> taxapyer) pays for that. Only if you are a liberal do you ignore such
> Only if there were no hybrids. I would like to thank you for paying your
> portion of my rebate, but the source of it doesn't affect the fit in my
> pocket. I think of it along the same lines as the development cost for
> Velcro, also funded by the taxpayer.
From: who on 5 Jul 2007 14:09
In article <VzZii.7981$7k7.3835(a)trnddc01>,
Jeff <kidsdoc2000(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
> There is no indication that the life of the batteries are a limiting
> factor to the life of the car. All indications are that the batteries do
> not wear out.
Currently rechargeable batteries start going down hill at about 3 years.
The fact that they are much weaker between 5 and the 8 yr guarantee
point would not be that noticeable as the Prius battery is very large.
A Prius might then be running as a mild hybrid, not going so far on
What Toyota is really saying (quietly to themselves) is that the
batteries will last for the original buyers term with the car.
Very few new car buyers keep a car 8 years.
From: B A R R Y on 5 Jul 2007 15:03
> In article <VzZii.7981$7k7.3835(a)trnddc01>,
> Jeff <kidsdoc2000(a)hotmail.com> wrote:
>> There is no indication that the life of the batteries are a limiting
>> factor to the life of the car. All indications are that the batteries do
>> not wear out.
> Dream on.
> Currently rechargeable batteries start going down hill at about 3 years.
> The fact that they are much weaker between 5 and the 8 yr guarantee
> point would not be that noticeable as the Prius battery is very large.
> A Prius might then be running as a mild hybrid, not going so far on
> battery only.
Which would cause the gas mileage to drop.
My in-laws are still driving a first generation Prius, a 2002, with over
100k. The MPG is the same as it ever was.
From: mrv on 5 Jul 2007 15:31
On Jul 3, 10:50 pm, "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <e...(a)nastydesigns.com> wrote:
> In article <1183513496.126153.143...(a)k29g2000hsd.googlegroups.com>,
> "m...(a)kluge.net" <m...(a)kluge.net> wrote:
> > Sorry, I don't have data on the Ford Escape hybrid/Mercury Mariner
> > hybrid, for the relevant other group...
> Ford licenses Toyota's HSD, do they not?
Is Ford using the Toyota hybrid system?
Although the Ford hybrid system is very similar to Toyota's, Toyota is
not directly supplying any components to Ford. Toyota and Ford have
entered into a licensing agreement allowing Ford to use technology
that had been patented by Toyota. Toyota welcomes the introduction of
the Escape hybrid and Ford's effort to demonstrate and gain acceptance
of this important environmental technology.
From: Jeff on 5 Jul 2007 17:59
Mike Hunter wrote:
> Actually both Toyota and Ford are likened to each others technology, since
> it was developed under a joint venture, via Volvo.
Actually, this article implies that Toyota developed the technology, and
Ford licensed the technology, apparently after working independently.
That is not a joint venture. It sounds like Ford and Toyota developed
similar technology and crossed licensed the technology to avoid legal
This paragraph supports this idea: "Ford also licensed Toyota hybrids
patents after its engineers realized that the system Ford had developed
had features similar to ones patented by Toyota. (Honda developed a
different hybrid system.)"
These articles also suggest that Ford got it hybrid technology from
Toyota, but not in a joint venture:
Ford and Volvo are working together to develop hybrid technology; they
opened a new hybrid technology center.
Volvo trucks and buses is developing hybrid technology, but Volvo trucks
is independent of Ford, AFIK.
> "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop(a)nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
>> In article <1183513496.126153.143730(a)k29g2000hsd.googlegroups.com>,
>> "mrv(a)kluge.net" <mrv(a)kluge.net> wrote:
>>> Sorry, I don't have data on the Ford Escape hybrid/Mercury Mariner
>>> hybrid, for the relevant other group...
>> Ford licenses Toyota's HSD, do they not?