The Drive-a-Toyota Act
in [Toyota]
|
From: Bill Putney on 4 Jul 2007 22:58 Jeff wrote: > Bill Putney wrote: > >> Jeff wrote: >> >>> Bill Putney wrote: >>> >>>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote: >>>> >>>>> In article <5f1c31F3ald6iU1(a)mid.individual.net>, >>>>> Bill Putney <bptn(a)kinez.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> And your hit on resale will be very big because potential buyers >>>>>> (the conscious ones anyway) will factor in the essential certainty >>>>>> that they will need to replace the batteries shortly down the road. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Just like potential buyers will factor in the essential certainty >>>>> that they will have a very expensive transmission repair on any >>>>> other car. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> That's BS. There is a *small* chance that there will be a major >>>> tranny problem on a given used car - yes, it is a risk, just as >>>> there is a risk that you'll walk outside and get run over by a >>>> truck, but nowhere near a certainty. Yet the batteries have a very >>>> understood *finite* life. You're really reaching with that argument. >>> >>> >>> >>> If it is so well understood, why don't you give us some references >>> about the life of a battery pack? >>> >>> Transmissions, engines, people - all have finite life times, too. >>> >>> Jeff >>> >>>> Bill Putney >>>> (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my >>>> address with the letter 'x') >> >> >> You ever deal with computer UPS battery packs in a large company? >> Battery life is *much* more finite than automatic transmissions - very >> narrow bell curve. > > > The technology for most UPS's is lead acid battery. > > The technology for hybrid cars is nickel hydride. > > You are comparing Apples and Oranges. > > Jeff > >> Bill Putney >> (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my >> address with the letter 'x') Life of NiMH batteries is limited to 800 to 1000 charge/discharge cycles - so end-of-life is predictable to a great extent. If deep discharged, power capacity and useable life are greatly reduced after 200-300 charge/discharge cycles. So - yeah - used market value should be affected quite a bit by answer to question "Were batteries replaced yet?". Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')
From: Bill Putney on 4 Jul 2007 23:05 This has nothing directly to do with this discussion, but Al Gore's son was arrested today for illegal possession of about 5 different drugs. But the interesting thing is that, prior to the finding of drugs, he was initially stopped for doing over 100 mph in a Prius. There has to be a Far Side� cartoon in that story somewhere. Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')
From: Bill Putney on 4 Jul 2007 23:09 Bill Putney wrote: > > This has nothing directly to do with this discussion, but Al Gore's son > was arrested today for illegal possession of about 5 different drugs. > But the interesting thing is that, prior to the finding of drugs, he was > initially stopped for doing over 100 mph in a Prius. There has to be a > Far Side� cartoon in that story somewhere. > > Bill Putney > (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my > address with the letter 'x') Oh - and perhaps Gore's son has enough carbon credits to get out of the legal mess, being that he was driving a Prius, or maybe he can buy some credits from his father. Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')
From: Jeff on 4 Jul 2007 23:15 Bill Putney wrote: > Jeff wrote: > >> Bill Putney wrote: >> >>> Jeff wrote: >>> >>>> Bill Putney wrote: >>>> >>>>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> In article <5f1c31F3ald6iU1(a)mid.individual.net>, >>>>>> Bill Putney <bptn(a)kinez.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> And your hit on resale will be very big because potential buyers >>>>>>> (the conscious ones anyway) will factor in the essential >>>>>>> certainty that they will need to replace the batteries shortly >>>>>>> down the road. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Just like potential buyers will factor in the essential certainty >>>>>> that they will have a very expensive transmission repair on any >>>>>> other car. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> That's BS. There is a *small* chance that there will be a major >>>>> tranny problem on a given used car - yes, it is a risk, just as >>>>> there is a risk that you'll walk outside and get run over by a >>>>> truck, but nowhere near a certainty. Yet the batteries have a very >>>>> understood *finite* life. You're really reaching with that argument. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> If it is so well understood, why don't you give us some references >>>> about the life of a battery pack? >>>> >>>> Transmissions, engines, people - all have finite life times, too. >>>> >>>> Jeff >>>> >>>>> Bill Putney >>>>> (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my >>>>> address with the letter 'x') >>> >>> >>> You ever deal with computer UPS battery packs in a large company? >>> Battery life is *much* more finite than automatic transmissions - >>> very narrow bell curve. >> >> >> The technology for most UPS's is lead acid battery. >> >> The technology for hybrid cars is nickel hydride. >> >> You are comparing Apples and Oranges. >> >> Jeff >> >>> Bill Putney >>> (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my >>> address with the letter 'x') > > Life of NiMH batteries is limited to 800 to 1000 charge/discharge cycles > - so end-of-life is predictable to a great extent. > > If deep discharged, power capacity and useable life are greatly reduced > after 200-300 charge/discharge cycles. > > So - yeah - used market value should be affected quite a bit by answer > to question "Were batteries replaced yet?". Except that hybrid cars don't deep cycle the batteries. And the batteries, according to the testing by Toyota, should be good for the life of the car. <http://consumerguideauto.howstuffworks.com/hybrid-batteries-none-the-worse-for-wear-cga.htm> I suspect that Toyota knows far more about how long the batteries will last than either you or me. Unless you can offer some authoritative information, I am not going to waste my time answering to an know-it-all who is, once again, wrong. Jeff > Bill Putney > (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my > address with the letter 'x')
From: Jeff on 4 Jul 2007 23:28
Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote: > In article <_mZii.3427$bO2.2057(a)trnddc05>, > Jeff <kidsdoc2000(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > >> And the >> batteries, according to the testing by Toyota, should be good for the >> life of the car. > > I hate hearing statements like that. > > What that tells me is that Toyota says that when the batteries go out, > by definition you've reached the end of life of the car. > > That does NOT tell me that the batteries last a long time. Perhaps you should read the referenced article before commenting on one sentence about the article. There is no indication that the life of the batteries are a limiting factor to the life of the car. All indications are that the batteries do not wear out. Jeff |