From: Tegger on
Bruce L. Bergman <blnospambergman(a)earthlink.invalid> wrote in

> I'm in So Cal so I don't worry about rust much, but if I was in the
> snow belt I'd give the hubs and the back side of steel wheels a quick
> shot of High Heat Barbecue Paint when new, and whenever worked on, to
> keep the wheels from rusting to the hubs.

Not a good idea. The paint has thickness, which will wear down to nothing
with the constant flexing of the wheels. This risks loosening the lug nuts
and causing noises while cornering at low speed.

The correct solution is, very simply, to undo the lug nuts and remove the
wheels twice per year. While the wheels are off, rub some 50-grit emery
cloth on the hub/wheel interfaces, wipe them clean, then reinstall.

Rust-welding is a function of the time joints spend undisturbed. Disturb
the joints twice per year and you won't have any seized components.


From: Mark A on
"aarcuda69062" <nonelson(a)> wrote in message news:nonelson-
> Dead is dead.

Not exactly. Dying as a result of being crushed to death by a car is one of
the most excruciating ways to go. It is not instantaneous death. Don't even
think about yelling for help because in all likelihood you won't have enough
breadth to yell out loud enough that anyone can hear you.

From: Ray O on

"Built_Well" <Built_Well_Toyota(a)> wrote in message
> Steve W. wrote:
>> The short floor jack I use was well over $500.00 Made in the US and rated
>> for 4
>> tons with a 200% safety margin. The cheapest stands I use are 12 ton
>> rated and were 140 bucks for a pair. They weigh over 30 pounds each.
> ========
> Steve W., I don't think even Ray_O paid over $500 for
> a floor jack or $140 for a pair of stands. Steve W., are
> you in the auto repair business, and use the
> equipment on customer's vehicles? In that case,
> I could see justifying the expense.

According to the friend/co-worker I bought it from, the jack I use was in
the neighborhood of $400 new about 25 years ago. I paid him $50 for it.
I'm trying to find out what my dad did with his Snap-On jack, which has a
much longer wheelbase so it is easier to reach under the car.

My jack stands are only rated to 6 ton, but they are good enough for me.
Most of the stand is cast iron, not stamped, and probably weigh around 25
lbs each.

Like Steve W, I want something that absolutely positively won't fail if I'm
going to crawl under the car, and IMO, the money spent for a quality jack
and jack stands is a lot less than the hospital bills that will result from
a failure (if I'm lucky) or the damage to the vehicle from being dropped.

I have a fair collection of tools, and IMO, you get what you pay for. If I
think I will only use a tool once, I'll get a cheap tool like a Stanley, but
if I'm going to use it regularly, then I try to invest in quality. I ended
up with some Stanley screwdrivers, and the blades on every flat screwdriver
are either chipped and/or bent. The don't engage screw heads well,
resulting in more stripped screws. I don't like the feel of Stanley or
Craftsman screwdrivers in my hand - they are hard to grip and result in
blisters after long use, while the blades on my Snap-On and Mac screwdrivers
are still in perfect shape. The walls on cheap sockets are much thicker,
making them difficult to use in tight spaces, they don't grip bolt heads as
well as a good 6 point socket, the chrome finish chips off, and I've split
several cheap sockets. My fine-tooth Snap-on ratchets work much more
smoothly, especially when starting bolts, and the fine teeth allow better
back-and-forth motions when working in tight spaces.

For automotive applications, Snap-On, Mac, and Matco are what most pros use.
Plumbers seem to prefer Rigid tools, and electricians seem to prefer Klein
and Greenlee. Good tools make the work go more smoothly and fit in the hand

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)

From: Bob Johnson on
Mark A wrote:
> "Built_Well" <Built_Well_Toyota(a)> wrote in message
> news:1193067869.342351.153810(a)
>> I've finished trying to educate Mark A. His little mind
>> is into rhetorical games, not honest debate.
>> He's simply repeating the same thing post-after-post.
> Apparently I have to repeat it because you don't understand English. If you
> want to call that rhetoric, that is your problem.
> I explained the difference quite clearly. Toyota wants to err on the side of
> safety, and the other book wants to err on the side of making sure the wheel
> is flat against the hub before the lug nuts are tightened.

I think that if you're on the side of the road in the middle of the
night, and you're using that flimsy emergency jack, and your jacking
surface is mud or dirt or gravel, Toyota may have the right idea: Put
that wheel on fast, minimize the time the car is jacked up and get the
hell out of there! You are correct that Toyota had safety in mind with
these instructions. However, the real truth is that tire changes should
only be done by someone with experience who knows what the dangers are.

I work on the car using a floor jack. I will always get the nuts seated
before putting any weight on the tires. The nuts are torqued a second
time with the tire barely touching and final torqued with the full
weight on the tires. I see no reason to do it any other way. OTOH, I
have been known to apply engine oil to my studs but don't try this at
home kids - I'm a very bad boy...

From: Scott Dorsey on
Built_Well <Built_Well_Toyota(a)> wrote:
>Scott Dorsey wrote:
>Well, Scott, this is the pleasant surprise. Although
>the 6-ton jack stands were on sale at Harbor Freight for only
>$20, they were of /surprisingly/ good quality.
>I will agree with you that some of Harbor Freight's low-end
>tools that are dirt-cheap are very poorly made and of bad
>quality (especially their cheap ratchet/socket sets), but the
>pleasant thing about these 6-ton jack stands was how well-made
>they were.

I have never seen any Harbor Freight products which I would want anywhere
near my shop, and certainly NOT on anything as critical as a jack stand.

After having a Harbor Freight anvil split open, after having a friend
injured by a casting defect in a Harbor Freight air tool, and after seeing
a Central Machine "lathe" with so much play in the leadscrew that you
couldn't accurately cut 20 tpi threads, I don't think I am ever going to
go anywhere near a Harbor Freight store ever again.

>However, as I mentioned last time, the DuraLast stands at
>AutoZone are the best I've seen.

You need to get out more. Take a look at the stands from Mac or
Snap-On or any of the industrial supply houses. They cost more, but
they are made from real metal.

>You won't be disappointed by the Harbor Freight stands. If you
>need some very good 6-ton stands really cheap, hurry in before
>their sale ends. And if you want the very best stands, pick
>up the DuraLast at AutoZone.

Hit it with a five-pound hammer. Does it leave a mark? Does it leave
a deep indentation? Look at the welds: are they holding shear tension
or just compression? Do they look nice and clean or do they look ragged
and full of voids? Or are they just tack welds in the first place?

Jack stands are holding several tons of metal a few inches above your
face. This is NOT an application where you want to get cheap products.
Get cheap wrenches and cheap screwdrivers. Get a cheap dwell meter.
Don't get cheap jackstands.
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."