From: mack on

"C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:45f9b22b$1(a)kcnews01...
> Borrowed off the Internet....I am just the messenger, although I agree
> that the new Tundra ads are deliberately misleading....
>
> Lou Kaltenstein
> President
> Gene Norris Buick-GMC Trucks Inc./Norris Auto Group
> 18170 Bagley Rd
> Middleburg Hts., Ohio 44130
>
> There has been a lot of talk about Toyota Tundra's new ads and how
> impressive they are. Here are some myths about their spots that I have
> found and that should be refuted. Also, they are offering a "IVC" type
> program on Tundra to help with sales.
>
> I would guess all of you have seen the ad where the Tundra pulls a trailer
> up a steep grade (a 'see-saw'), and then barrels down hill and locks the
> brakes up just before the end of the ramp. Many of you have commented on
> how well done the spot is visually. However, here are the actual facts to
> share with people:
>
> 1. The V.O. at the beginning of the spot says...."It's tough pushing
> 10,000 lbs up a steep grade". Myth: Toyota would like the audience to
> believe the trailer is 10,000 lbs. Fact: It's a 5,000 lb truck pulling a
> 5,000 lb trailer. A little slight of hand? You bet.
>

It's tough pushing 10,000 lbs up a steep grade. I may not be a numbers
cruncher by trade,
but the last time I looked, 5000 lbs of truck plus 5000 lbs of trailer
equals 10,000 lbs.
Where's the deception? No 'sleight' of hand here.



> 2. Then, on the way down the grade, the camera zooms in on the brakes as
> the vehicles comes to a screeching halt just prior to the end of ramp.
> Next time you see the ad....look for the 'mice type'. It indicates the
> trailer is equipped with electric brakes. Fact....the electric brakes stop
> the trailer -- not the truck. A little slight of hand? You bet.

I guess the 'mice type' was large enough for you to read, and to note the
fact
that the trailer has electric brakes. No deception here either.
>
> 3. And why does Toyota have bigger brake pads? They need them....their
> truck is heavier. Stopping distance between our truck and theirs is
> virtually identical. And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To
> improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours.

You say "virtually" identical. What are the ACTUAL stopping distances of
the
two trucks?????
A six speed transmission is inherently more versatile than a four speed.
SO?

>
> 4. And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel
> much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel
> economy.
>
> Ed

Mebbe, but the Toyota will still be driving like a new truck when the GMC is
on
its third owner, or in a boneyard.


From: Ed White on
On Mar 16, 1:19 pm, "mack" <macke...(a)dslextreme.com> wrote:
> "C. E. White" <cewhi...(a)removemindspring.com> wrote in messagenews:45f9b22b$1(a)kcnews01...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Borrowed off the Internet....I am just the messenger, although I agree
> > that the new Tundra ads are deliberately misleading....
>
> > Lou Kaltenstein
> > President
> > Gene Norris Buick-GMC Trucks Inc./Norris Auto Group
> > 18170 Bagley Rd
> > Middleburg Hts., Ohio 44130
>
> > There has been a lot of talk about Toyota Tundra's new ads and how
> > impressive they are. Here are some myths about their spots that I have
> > found and that should be refuted. Also, they are offering a "IVC" type
> > program on Tundra to help with sales.
>
> > I would guess all of you have seen the ad where the Tundra pulls a trailer
> > up a steep grade (a 'see-saw'), and then barrels down hill and locks the
> > brakes up just before the end of the ramp. Many of you have commented on
> > how well done the spot is visually. However, here are the actual facts to
> > share with people:
>
> > 1. The V.O. at the beginning of the spot says...."It's tough pushing
> > 10,000 lbs up a steep grade". Myth: Toyota would like the audience to
> > believe the trailer is 10,000 lbs. Fact: It's a 5,000 lb truck pulling a
> > 5,000 lb trailer. A little slight of hand? You bet.
>
> It's tough pushing 10,000 lbs up a steep grade. I may not be a numbers
> cruncher by trade,
> but the last time I looked, 5000 lbs of truck plus 5000 lbs of trailer
> equals 10,000 lbs.
> Where's the deception? No 'sleight' of hand here.
>
> > 2. Then, on the way down the grade, the camera zooms in on the brakes as
> > the vehicles comes to a screeching halt just prior to the end of ramp.
> > Next time you see the ad....look for the 'mice type'. It indicates the
> > trailer is equipped with electric brakes. Fact....the electric brakes stop
> > the trailer -- not the truck. A little slight of hand? You bet.
>
> I guess the 'mice type' was large enough for you to read, and to note the
> fact
> that the trailer has electric brakes. No deception here either.
>
>
>
> > 3. And why does Toyota have bigger brake pads? They need them....their
> > truck is heavier. Stopping distance between our truck and theirs is
> > virtually identical. And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To
> > improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours.
>
> You say "virtually" identical. What are the ACTUAL stopping distances of
> the
> two trucks?????
> A six speed transmission is inherently more versatile than a four speed.
> SO?
>
>
>
> > 4. And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel
> > much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel
> > economy.
>
> > Ed
>
> Mebbe, but the Toyota will still be driving like a new truck when the GMC is
> on
> its third owner, or in a boneyard.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Why do you think that? Any proof, or just wild speculation.

Ed

From: JoeSpareBedroom on
"Ed White" <ce.white3(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1174068142.493211.246440(a)n59g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...

>>
>> Mebbe, but the Toyota will still be driving like a new truck when the GMC
>> is
>> on
>> its third owner, or in a boneyard.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> Why do you think that? Any proof, or just wild speculation.
>
> Ed
>


Cars can require two general categories of service:

- Normal: Things everyone expects, like tires, oil/filter, fuel filter,
belts, battery, and even things that don't necessarily have a scheduled
replacement time, but which experienced drivers are aware of, like
alternator, pumps.

- Outrageous repairs required because of hideous flaws in design &
manufacturing:

Example - my sister's 1983 Buick, perfectly maintained, driven normally,
transmission has meltdown at 60,000 miles.

Example - my 1992 Taurus. Fusible link located at bottom of engine
compartment, completely unprotected from the elements. Link and its
connectors corroded and turned to crumbs, preventing car from starting.
Since it's common knowledge that electrical connections need to be
thoroughly protected in engine compartments, we can safely conclude that the
car's designer intended for this problem to occur, perhaps as a prank.

Example - Chrysler mini-vans. I can identify them blindfolded, just by the
smell of their exhausts. One year old and they stink like an ancient Blazer.
It's strange, because Chrysler owns some of the same CNC machining equipment
used at Toyota factories. But, they choose to run them sloppy. Don't ask my
source, I won't tell you, but I'm sure you'll dispute it. Enjoy.

Example - another Ford I owned, mid 1970s. Stick shift held onto tranny by a
nylon (plastic) threaded ring. Exhaust located 4 inches from that spot.
Nylon ring softens from heat, threads deteriorate, so one day, I downshift
from 3rd to 2nd and end up holding a shifter that's attached to nothing,
other than being held to the console by the boot. Wait. It gets better: The
dealer claims they've never heard of this before. That didn't work, for
reasons not important here. They fixed it for free. Six months later, same
thing. I decide to fix it myself, since it was summertime and I was curious.
Parts guy says "Oh yeah...we always keep that ring in stock. Lots of
problems." Why didn't the shop want to fix it for free without being
coerced? Because in order to fix it, you had to remove the front seats,
remove all the carpet trim, lift the carpet, so you could finally get to the
screws that held the console in place. Under the console were hidden the
screws that held the shifter boot to the transmission hump. Actual time to
replace the melted ring: two minutes.

You really need to stop mixing religion with your opinions about cars.


From: Mike Hunter on
Those commercials are meant to influence Tacoma and Camry buyers that may
want a full size truck. The fact is the standard pay load of the Tundra is
only 10,000 LB. Real truck buyers know better. The Silverado standard
pay load is 10,500 LB and the F150 is 11,000 LB, both of which cost less
than the Tundra as well. ;)



mike
"C. E. White" <cewhite3(a)removemindspring.com> wrote in message
news:45f9b22b$1(a)kcnews01...
> Borrowed off the Internet....I am just the messenger, although I agree
> that the new Tundra ads are deliberately misleading....
>
> Lou Kaltenstein
> President
> Gene Norris Buick-GMC Trucks Inc./Norris Auto Group
> 18170 Bagley Rd
> Middleburg Hts., Ohio 44130
>
> There has been a lot of talk about Toyota Tundra's new ads and how
> impressive they are. Here are some myths about their spots that I have
> found and that should be refuted. Also, they are offering a "IVC" type
> program on Tundra to help with sales.
>
> I would guess all of you have seen the ad where the Tundra pulls a trailer
> up a steep grade (a 'see-saw'), and then barrels down hill and locks the
> brakes up just before the end of the ramp. Many of you have commented on
> how well done the spot is visually. However, here are the actual facts to
> share with people:
>
> 1. The V.O. at the beginning of the spot says...."It's tough pushing
> 10,000 lbs up a steep grade". Myth: Toyota would like the audience to
> believe the trailer is 10,000 lbs. Fact: It's a 5,000 lb truck pulling a
> 5,000 lb trailer. A little slight of hand? You bet.
>
> 2. Then, on the way down the grade, the camera zooms in on the brakes as
> the vehicles comes to a screeching halt just prior to the end of ramp.
> Next time you see the ad....look for the 'mice type'. It indicates the
> trailer is equipped with electric brakes. Fact....the electric brakes stop
> the trailer -- not the truck. A little slight of hand? You bet.
>
> 3. And why does Toyota have bigger brake pads? They need them....their
> truck is heavier. Stopping distance between our truck and theirs is
> virtually identical. And why does Toyota have a 6 speed transmission? To
> improve their fuel economy....which is still 2 mpg less than ours.
>
> 4. And don't forget....their big V8 has one axle ratio -- a 4.3. Suck fuel
> much? Our trucks offer several axle options to optimize towing and fuel
> economy.
>
> Ed
>


From: Mike Hunter on
Get real. Ford is the Silverado competition not the Tundra. Ford sells 35%
of the full-size trucks in the US. Chevy 30% and Toyota a measly 5%. The
base engine in the Tundra is a only a V6. The F150 has a six speed and a V8
is standard as well. The Tundra is just beginning to catch up to the build
quality of what GM, Ford and Dodge have been offering in their truck for
years


mike


"zonie" <sjemoomaw(a)nospam> wrote in message
news:c6950a88731728c35f399ae2cf13a86e(a)localhost.talkaboutautos.com...
> Time will tell what the Tundra can do. Sounds like the GM people are
> nervous about somebody coming up with competition. He forgets to mention
> taht also with the 4.3 axle ratio the Tndra has a 6 speed auto which
> probably about equals their higher ratios with the 4 speed auto that they
> have. Scott
>