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From: Jeff Strickland on 20 Apr 2008 16:37

"franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
news:eGNOj.2154$pS4.1475(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.net...
> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 20:19:27 +0000, franz fripplfrappl wrote:
>
>> Update:
>>
>> Had engine codes read:
>>
>> P0441
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> Purge Flow Fault
>>
>> P0446
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> Vent Circuit Malfunction
>>
>> P0441
>> as above
>>
>> P0442
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> ... leak (small)
>>
>> P0446
>> as above
>
> After finding out the codes, we reset the codes via an option on the
> reader. Both check engine and VSC lights are out for the moment.
>
> I checked to make sure the gas cap is on tight. Have also checked the
> hoses coming from the air cleaner housing.
>
> Any other suggestions?


Wait to see if the light comes on again. My guess is that somebody fills the
tank and does not ratchet the cap 3 or 4 times, this can result in the cap
not seating fully which can result in a leak in an otherwise sealed system.





From: franz fripplfrappl on 20 Apr 2008 16:50
On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 20:35:21 +0000, Jeff Strickland wrote:

> These faults have the easiest roots in a loose gas cap. They could be
> more serious, but before you spend any time or money on anything, erase
> all faults and be sure to seal the gas cap after every fill up.
>
> The second most common fault is a break in a vac line, followed by an
> actual problem with a system component. The evap emissions control
> system (fumes from the gas tank) are the result of a poorly seated gas
> cap more often than not. The system must be sealed to function properly,
> and the most common break in the seal is the gas cap. There can be other
> causes, to be sure, but until the gas cap is isolated, I'd not spend any
> time or money on any of them.
>
> I suggest erasing all codes and waiting to see if any of them return. In
> the mean time make sure you seal the gas cap every time you fill the
> tank. If the cap has a ratchet when it locks, be sure to set the ratchet
> 3 or 4 clicks.
>
>
> None of these deal with the VSC.
>
>
>
>
> "franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:jzNOj.4960$iK6.4873(a)nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>> Update:
>>
>> Had engine codes read:
>>
>> P0441
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> Purge Flow Fault
>>
>> P0446
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> Vent Circuit Malfunction
>>
>> P0441
>> as above
>>
>> P0442
>> Evap Emission Control System
>> ... leak (small)
>>
>> P0446
>> as above

Thanks.
I've only had the vehicle a week now and have put gas 2x into tank. I
will be more attentive to tightening the gas cap. Will report back if
lights go on again.

I have read that sometimes the lights could indicate either a charcoal
canister or its associated sensor. let's hope it's no more than a loose
gas cap.

From: Jeff Strickland on 20 Apr 2008 17:01

"franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
news:w0OOj.4963$iK6.3672(a)nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 20:35:21 +0000, Jeff Strickland wrote:
>
>> These faults have the easiest roots in a loose gas cap. They could be
>> more serious, but before you spend any time or money on anything, erase
>> all faults and be sure to seal the gas cap after every fill up.
>>
>> The second most common fault is a break in a vac line, followed by an
>> actual problem with a system component. The evap emissions control
>> system (fumes from the gas tank) are the result of a poorly seated gas
>> cap more often than not. The system must be sealed to function properly,
>> and the most common break in the seal is the gas cap. There can be other
>> causes, to be sure, but until the gas cap is isolated, I'd not spend any
>> time or money on any of them.
>>
>> I suggest erasing all codes and waiting to see if any of them return. In
>> the mean time make sure you seal the gas cap every time you fill the
>> tank. If the cap has a ratchet when it locks, be sure to set the ratchet
>> 3 or 4 clicks.
>>
>>
>> None of these deal with the VSC.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
>> news:jzNOj.4960$iK6.4873(a)nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>>> Update:
>>>
>>> Had engine codes read:
>>>
>>> P0441
>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>> Purge Flow Fault
>>>
>>> P0446
>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>> Vent Circuit Malfunction
>>>
>>> P0441
>>> as above
>>>
>>> P0442
>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>> ... leak (small)
>>>
>>> P0446
>>> as above
>
> Thanks.
> I've only had the vehicle a week now and have put gas 2x into tank. I
> will be more attentive to tightening the gas cap. Will report back if
> lights go on again.
>
> I have read that sometimes the lights could indicate either a charcoal
> canister or its associated sensor. let's hope it's no more than a loose
> gas cap.
>

It's possible that the cap is not the problem, but before dropping loads
upon loads of dimes chasing down any of the possibilities, you could spend
an extra moment making sure the cap is getting sealed properly.

To be honest, when the cap is the problem, the failure code should translate
to either a malfunction, gross leak, or a minor leak. I recall these codes
to be P0440, P0441, and P0442. You listed both 441 and 442, so I'll keep my
money on the cap. You also listed the purge valve as P0441, but I recall
this to be different (I could look it up, but I don't feel like it, and my
money is on the cap).



From: franz fripplfrappl on 20 Apr 2008 17:15
On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 21:01:13 +0000, Jeff Strickland wrote:

> "franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
> news:w0OOj.4963$iK6.3672(a)nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 20:35:21 +0000, Jeff Strickland wrote:
>>
>>> These faults have the easiest roots in a loose gas cap. They could be
>>> more serious, but before you spend any time or money on anything,
>>> erase all faults and be sure to seal the gas cap after every fill up.
>>>
>>> The second most common fault is a break in a vac line, followed by an
>>> actual problem with a system component. The evap emissions control
>>> system (fumes from the gas tank) are the result of a poorly seated gas
>>> cap more often than not. The system must be sealed to function
>>> properly, and the most common break in the seal is the gas cap. There
>>> can be other causes, to be sure, but until the gas cap is isolated,
>>> I'd not spend any time or money on any of them.
>>>
>>> I suggest erasing all codes and waiting to see if any of them return.
>>> In the mean time make sure you seal the gas cap every time you fill
>>> the tank. If the cap has a ratchet when it locks, be sure to set the
>>> ratchet 3 or 4 clicks.
>>>
>>>
>>> None of these deal with the VSC.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
>>> news:jzNOj.4960$iK6.4873(a)nlpi069.nbdc.sbc.com...
>>>> Update:
>>>>
>>>> Had engine codes read:
>>>>
>>>> P0441
>>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>>> Purge Flow Fault
>>>>
>>>> P0446
>>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>>> Vent Circuit Malfunction
>>>>
>>>> P0441
>>>> as above
>>>>
>>>> P0442
>>>> Evap Emission Control System
>>>> ... leak (small)
>>>>
>>>> P0446
>>>> as above
>>
>> Thanks.
>> I've only had the vehicle a week now and have put gas 2x into tank. I
>> will be more attentive to tightening the gas cap. Will report back if
>> lights go on again.
>>
>> I have read that sometimes the lights could indicate either a charcoal
>> canister or its associated sensor. let's hope it's no more than a
>> loose gas cap.
>>
>>
> It's possible that the cap is not the problem, but before dropping loads
> upon loads of dimes chasing down any of the possibilities, you could
> spend an extra moment making sure the cap is getting sealed properly.
>
> To be honest, when the cap is the problem, the failure code should
> translate to either a malfunction, gross leak, or a minor leak. I recall
> these codes to be P0440, P0441, and P0442. You listed both 441 and 442,
> so I'll keep my money on the cap. You also listed the purge valve as
> P0441, but I recall this to be different (I could look it up, but I
> don't feel like it, and my money is on the cap).



Thanks again. Will check the cap and make sure gasket and where it seats
are both clean and smooth. May even put o-ring lubricant just to be sure.
From: Jeff Strickland on 20 Apr 2008 17:25

"franz fripplfrappl" <bogus(a)bogus.net> wrote in message
news:unOOj.1106$ix6.929(a)newssvr11.news.prodigy.net...
>
>
> Thanks again. Will check the cap and make sure gasket and where it seats
> are both clean and smooth. May even put o-ring lubricant just to be sure.

You can do that if you want, but all you really need to do is make sure the
cap clicks a few times when you put it on. If you have others that also put
gas in the car -- a Main Squeeze for example -- them make sure they also put
several clicks on the cap. AFTER you do that, then star looking at the cap
itself.

This is not a problem that will cause any other problems. You have plenty of
time to investigate doing stuff that is free before you have to open the
checkbook for professional repairs.




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