From: SMS on 24 Nov 2008 23:09
> Mark A wrote:
>> "WindsorFox<[SS]>" <windsor.fox.usenet(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> Amsoil meets or surpasses API specs, yes, according to them and one
>>> type is API certified. There is a difference between can not and
>>> refusing to provide some proprietary information.
>> The big lie.
> You have proof of Amsoil lying? If you do I am sure that by all means
> a lot of people would be interested in it.
During the whole API debate they lied repeatedly. They came up with
amazing fabrications about why they didn't certify their oils, including
lying about the cost of certification, and lying about being worried
about API leaking the formulation of their synthetic. As it turned out,
the real reason was that they knew they couldn't get certified because
of the level of ZDDP.
What's incredible is that they felt they had to resort to that sort of
thing. No one would have thought any worse of them if they had simply
said 'hey, our non-API oil is ideal for motorcycles, snowmobiles, or
anything without a catalytic converter, but if for vehicles with CATs
please use our API certified oil.'
When they started making up stories they lost all credibility.
From: HLS on 25 Nov 2008 08:57
"Brent P" <tetraethylleadREMOVETHIS(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message news:zPudnb-
.. The manufacturers have too much riding
> through the warranty period to take that kind of risk.
I would think that not only the vehicle manufacturer has a lot of exposure,
but also the
filter manufacturer which sells to aftermarket (like Walmart, for instance)
into a chain of responsibility for damage.
If you want a cheapo filter, they are on the market. You have to pay for
not necessarily dealer's prices.
I have used Fram filters in the past, and have never had an incident with
them at all.
I use a NAPA filter on our Avalon, and "whatever" on my old van.
From: Mark A on 24 Nov 2008 15:26
"Tegger" <invalid(a)invalid.inv> wrote in message
> Let's make that "expert" opinions (with quotes).
> Without the results of properly designed empirical testing, everybody's an
> "expert", the way doctors were "experts" at infectious disease before the
> discovery of microbes.
> My personal and untested opinion is that most aftermarket oil filters are
> about the same quality as most aftermarket car parts, which is to say of
> poor and/or questionable quality. that's why I only ever buy OEM for our
> (Honda and Toyota) vehicles.
Some after-market parts are worse than OEM, and some are better than OEM.
That includes oil filters.
From: "WindsorFox [SS]>" on 25 Nov 2008 10:36
> During the whole API debate they lied repeatedly. They came up with
> amazing fabrications about why they didn't certify their oils, including
> lying about the cost of certification, and lying about being worried
> about API leaking the formulation of their synthetic. As it turned out,
> the real reason was that they knew they couldn't get certified because
> of the level of ZDDP.
BTW, where did this debate you refer to take place? I'd like to go
back and read the archive of it.
From: Steve on 25 Nov 2008 10:50
> "Steve" <no(a)spam.thanks> wrote in message
>> They're out there, in spades. The aftermarket frequently comes up with
>> "problem solver" replacement parts a long time before the OEM even
>> fesses up to a defect (particularly Toyota, which never admits
>> anything until the numbers are overwhelming and the internet is on
>> fire with complaints).
> One of my FLAPS friends told me that they have to do better, or they would
> be out of business. You couldnt sell OEM problematic plenums in the
> for nearly ten years.....Your customers would take your scalp.
> I can remember a time when Chrysler put out a long series of substandard
> cylinders...The cure was to replace it with EIS or some other
> aftermarket unit.
> There are many examples of this.
Like Fel-Pro having MLS head gaskets available for problematic Honda,
Chrysler, and Toyota engines at least 2 years before any one of them
admitted that there was a need for such a change from the traditional